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Trefriw, Conwy: Any comments I could make have already been made on the site. As a regular walker in out-of-the-way areas, my main concern is access, and more importantly, the total inability to know what to wear or carry if this decision has to be made several miles away where conditions may be very different - especially in the winter. As someone who actually lives within the boundaries of the Park, and who regularly travels within the Perk, I honestly don't think that traffic congestion is a problem anyway. Moreover, I am certain that the economy of the Park will suffer terribly - if
pursuing their hobby is made difficult, people will simply stay away in droves.
Selly Oak: I wish to protest against the idea of allowing cars only at certain designated points and encouraging people to use buses. This could be disastrous, if people come down cold and wet from the hill and the buses don't run, or are too full to get on. I grew up in the Snowdonia National Park and still visit there occasionally. In my experience, traffic problems are not caused by walkers and climbers but by motor tourists who want to do nothing more than travel from A to B by car, looking at the scenery.
Buckley, Flintshire: As a mountaineering instructor I agree 100% with your
comments. I own the climbing wall in Chester and I am more than happy to lobby all my customers,
and hold a public meeting on my premises,
I'm only sorry that I was unaware that this was being pushed thru on the
qt. Do we have a chance of stopping it? get back to me asap and I will start the ball rolling.
Llanddona, Anglesey: A walk after work in June, up the Pyg track to the summit, watch the sunset, back down by full moon; try to do that with park and ride.
Frodsham, Chesire: I fully support your campaign to prevent this ill-thought out scheme which will affect the way that many enjoy the National Park.
Stafford: Please fight these utterly stupid plans with all of your might. I live equidistant from N Wales & the Lakes and if I have a choice between driving to a car park in Langdale/ Coniston/ Patterdale etc. then going out on the Hill and finally returning to a welcoming pub for a beer/coffee and meal before returning to a local rented cottage or driving to Betwys/Llanberis etc. waiting for a bus, catching a bus, going on the hill, waiting (probably wet through & cold) for a bus, or the next one if the first is full, travelling back to the car park and going home via a pub stop along the A5 then I will almost
always choose the first option. Yes, there will be times when I will return to N Wales for a special reason, but they will be few and far between. Perhaps these muddle headed do-gooders should get some seasonal experience under their soft feet before they interfere with the incomes and prosperity of local people, because if other hill goers are like me, they will spend their money elsewhere. I am sure that more local jobs will be lost than will be created.
One final point; I have, this evening, returned from a skiing holiday in Chamonix where the length of the valley is served by FREE buses and also has FREE car parks at each of the main ski areas. The numerous buses, which tend to come in three's or four's!, are fine for those tourists who have come by train or 'plane, but for the many who drive from all over Europe, they just do not offer the convenience required. Like N Wales, the Chamonix valley is spread out and if visitors cannot move around it
conveniently, I am sure that they, like me will go elsewhere. It will be the local businesses and people who suffer. Those that interfere will return to their safe houses and
guaranteed monthly incomes or pensions to find and fight other politically correct causes. Please, please, please don't let the loony Left win. It's not their lives that are affected, it's not their businesses that will be closed down, it's not their incomes, marriages, Bank Managers, children, mortgages that will suffer the consequences and trauma of a collapsed local economy. Rikshaws, that's what we need! Powered by do-gooding loony Lefties. Pollution free, except for their verbal diarrhoea. At least that should add to the mountain atmosphere.
Shrewsbury: Horrified to read of the proposals. Is someone trying to rush through the consultation at the quietest time of the year?
Droitwich: A park and ride scheme will reduce congestion but by limiting numbers visiting AND SPENDING MONEY IN NORTH WALES will have a detrimental effect on the local economy. Other road users, heavy transport etc will benefit but is this what is wanted? I have climbed in Snowdonia for over forty years and on refection it is patently obvious that access to personal or shared transport is vital. Only on arrival at the start of a climb in winter can one asses just what equipment is needed. When emergencies, bad weather, finding lost climbers, helping with accidents etc. crop up, and they do all too
frequently, limiting access to reserve equipment left in a ca and relying on public transport will only put a far greater burden on the official emergency services. Certainly there is a case for paying for parking, extending the pay and display areas to the large lay-byes on the A5 at Ogwen for up to 18 hours, for example, but to ban parking is completely unrealistic and displays a frightening lack of understanding by the architects of the plan.
Llandudno, Conwy: I am not sure if I have already registered here but I am so opposed to the Park and Ride that I want to make sure my complaint is registered
Llandegfan, Anglesey: This scheme will be detrimental to the local economies of places such as LLanberis or Bethesda. Faced with a choice of using an infrequent bus service, or climbing elsewhere, local recreational climbers such as myself will choose the latter. The beneficiaries will be the economies of Porthmadog and Holyhead. Users of the park must have choice of access - that is the very essence of why they are there.
Bethesda, Gwynedd: Improve the bus service by all means, but park and ride is not the answer. Clear the roads of dangerous 'on road' parked cars?, certainly, but the closing of
legitimate lay byes and and off road pull-in should not be allowed. I have many friends out side of Wales who would no longer come to climb and walk our lovely mountains if park and ride was introduced, and they do spend money when they are
here!! I thought foot and mouth would have made people realise how much we need the tourist, we should not be putting restrictions on them.
Dyserth: Let us all join to stop this
preposterous proposition or we will lose the freedom of Wales for all
Chester: I am Chester-based mountaineer/climber/biker, and have just read the Snowdonia Green Key document. I fully support your campaign to stop the Park and Ride scheme. I spend a lot of days in the Snowdonia Park (but also in the Peak and Lake District parks, as well as mountain areas in Europe and USA). Before addressing on the solution, I would comment on two of the "problems" raised in the Green Key report.
1. People visiting Snowdonia spend less (than e.g. the Lake District). This has nothing to do with park policy but on the quality of services available. Apart from one or two notable
climbers cafes, facilities in Snowdonia do not match other parks, and I think Snowdonia businesses need to do some benchmarking here.
2. Damage through pollution will increase in line with projected car numbers. Not true, pollution is dependant not only on vehicle numbers but on engine size and speed. I have not seen figures on the proportion of vehicles using the Ogwen and Llanberis Pass roads which do not stop at all - it is not the parking places which cause pollution, it is the roads, with trucks and buses as well as cars. I would favour adressing the problem holistically rather than taking it out on the mountain users. Greatly reduced speed limits on all the trunk roads would cut pollution and discourage through traffic. I would not be against a fee to enter the park (for all traffic, whether stopping or not), but parking in the park should be free, and based on numerous small sites rather than huge ones - 10 cars can be easily masked, 100 cannot. If the scheme goes ahead, I anticipate it will add 2-3 (frustrating) hours to a typical day out for me in Snowdonia. I will go
somewhere else.
Romsey, Hants & Cwm Machno: I wrote a 4-page critique of the original N Snowdonia study and sent it to a number of bodies including the park itself about 1999, but
received minimal acknowledgement. I am amazed that this crazy scheme has reappeared.
I will dig out my earlier document and supply it to you. I am finding these linked websites very
difficult to navigate but would very much like to make further representations. I live in
Hampshire now but have a permanent second home (since 1963) in Snowdonia.
Reading: Park& Ride - the daftest suggestion
i've come across in a long time. Totally impractical unless the idea is to clear the hillsides, teashops and gearshops of punters.
Cleeve Prior, Evesham: In addition to fully endorsing the observations made by all other
climbers, walkers and other interested parties I would make the following personal observations:-
1)I needed to buy some new gear but instead of shopping locally I decided to combine my shopping with a day in the mountains. So Last week ( 13Feb ) I got up at 5.30 and drove approx 140 miles to Snowdonia. I had my breakfast in the Pinnacle Cafe in Capel Curig - PARKING RIGHT OUTSIDE - and spent £35 in Pinnacle Pursuits. I then drove to the Ogwen Cottage car park, paid my £1(winter
rate) and then set off for a walk (had the place to myself at first -
magic!) After the walk I then had a bit of a shopping spree and spent £500 in four different outdoor shops. IF I HAD NOT BEEN ABLE TO DRIVE DIRECTLY TO, AND PARK AT, MY CHOSEN DESTINATION THEN IT SIMPLY WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN WORTH THE EFFORT. I WOULD NOT HAVE MADE MY JOURNEY AND I WOULD HAVE SPENT MY MONEY CLOSER TO HOME.
2) In addition to climbing in Snowdonia both as an individual and with a club I quite often come over to Snowdonia with my family. Typically we might take a cottage in Beddgelert for a week. We may then drive to the car park near the start of the Watkin path and walk up Snowdon from there. Or drive to the Ogwen Cottage and then stroll around Cwm Idwal. If we could not easily drive to and park at or near these places it would be a major disincentive to us coming and spending our money on a cottage, buying our meals in the pubs and cafes or shopping at the big supermarket in Canaervon ALTHOUGH WE LOVE SNOWDONIA WE WOULD ALMOST CERTAINLY CHOOSE TO SPEND OUR WEEK IN THE LAKE DISTRICT INSTEAD.
Windsor: I have been visiting North Wales since the early 70's. I still regularly visit. I have sampled the bus service, or lack of it and can only comment that it was worse than useless. People visiting the area require flexibility to travel as and when they want and not as and when a bus service wants. A park and ride scheme that is forced upon those visiting the park will mean people will not visit. A loss revenue and a loss of freedom will be then end result. I seldom visit the peak district anymore because of the way parking has been organised. You're charged a fee to park and you're car is vandalised - so why visit. I enjoy North Wales and I'm happy to spent my cash while I'm there. If a park and ride scheme is forced upon me with traditional parking placed blocked off then in simple terms I won't visit. With the advent of cheap flights I can spent a weekend in Scotland or the Dolomites for marginally more than I spend getting to and staying in North Wales. I could even start to spent more time in the Lakes District - only another 30 miles to drive. The park and ride scheme has all the hallmarks of an
initiative dreamt up by a group of "greens" who ride bikes, don't understand why climbers/walkers/tourists visit and are generally dead from the neck
up (probably from the neck down as well).
Rhosgadfan, Gwynedd: The 'Park & Ride' scheme appears to be an attempt to manipulate the outdoor community. I believe that implementing this scheme will have a negative affect on the local economy and force away visitors. As a climber I feel strongly about the ability to park close to the cliffs I climb on. Having a vehicle nearby to shelter in, store spare clothes/food and to be used as transport in case of an emergency is essential.
Frodsham, Cheshire: I am dismayed by the plans to stop roadside parking in Snowdonia. I have been a regular visitor for many years both as a hill walker and rock climber and it appears to me that the park and ride plans will be very restrictive. I have been in the habit of arriving and leaving at odd hours and I cannot believe that a park and ride arrangement will meet my needs or indeed those of many others of a similar ilk.
Tregarth, Gwynedd: This scheme is simply not feasible. Park and ride is fine for going into town shopping but to apply it to a National Park where the users of the park will in the main be carrying rucksacks, bags of equipment, ice-climbing or parasailing gear is ludicrous. Will all the buses have an accompanying trailer that the park users can load their gear into, or will everyone just be crammed into the
bus, Japanese style. For those who are willing to pay the fee to actually bring their car into the National Park, a maximum 2 hour period is nowhere near long enough. In reality, this means the visitor will only be able to walk about an hour away from the car, a very expensive hours walk if you ask me. One of the major aspects of
Snowdonia National Park which attracts visitors is the ease with which the Park can be accessed. Climbers, hikers and leisure walkers all make very good use of the Park precisely because it is free. To charge people to use the Park (Which is what this amounts to) will result in a large drop in user numbers, not a gain. However, this plan will result in an improvement in the environment, primarily because it will stop anyone coming to the area. To sum up: a bad plan that needs to be scrapped and replaced by something that really copes with the present and future needs of the Park and its users.
Llanrug, Gwynedd: Without the freedom and right to roam for all, the local businesses are sure to suffer even more as the area will be abandoned by tourists due to excessive restrictions. As a local resident I intend to protest as fully as possible to maintain my rights to enjoy the countryside when and as I want. A general improvement in parking
areas, lay-by's and services are needed, complimented by a more useful public transport service. The visitors are drawn to the area by the scenery and open spaces and once they see the restrictions they will leave in their droves. Maybe a guided bus service will encourage some to leave their cars behind! It would not be my idea of a nice day out to travel to the area with my family, transfer to, wait and pay for for a bus, travel onwards in the company of strangers and then according to a schedule that probably would not suit.
Timberscombe, Somerset: I lived in North Wales during the late eighties and early nineties, and as an active mountaineer, still visit fairly regularly. If this scheme were introduced, it would have a negative effect on my willingness to continue to visit the area. Competition exists in the outdoors too, and Snowdonia has little to offer that is not available in other similar areas. 'Fleecing' your customers (i.e.: the visitors) is not a sustainable business model. Exploiting a natural resource in your area should not be seen as an exhortation to exploit climbers & ramblers. Just because they have a right of access to the land doesn't give the county council (or anyone else) a right of access to their wallets. People are particularly resentful of having to pay for something which was once free.
Llanfaes, Anglesey: I always thought the roads were the QUEENS highway and not the
preserve of a private
company. Also do we not pay a car tax to up keep these roads? FIGHT them all the way.
Reading: I am a climber who generally spends 5 or 6 weekends a year in Snowdonia. It is a 5 hour journey for me to get there, and if when I get there I am forced to park in an expensive car park then take a bus to somewhere other than where I actually want to go I will go somewhere closer that does not have those restrictions. My spending in the pubs, cafes and equipment shops of the area will be lost.
Halifax: Park and Ride is an excellent facility and should be used whenever possible. However, compulsory use of Park and Ride will impose a very serious restriction on access to a great number of people who have to travel some distance to get to Snowdonia. I am sure that the vast majority of these people fully appreciate the environment and are prepared to do their bit to maintain it. I do not
expect that excluding them from it by restrictions such as this will benefit the environment in the long term. Surely there is a need to be encouraging access and thereby passion and respect for this wonderful place.
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